tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post3592471396198469145..comments2024-02-03T15:50:36.996-06:00Comments on New Discovery: Bible numbers and its numbering is God given: Pretrib Rapture? Evidence references in the Bible - sharing my notes of unfinished researchNorm Patriquin/AmazingWordhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01623691057735943184noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-84939557007337555232014-03-01T17:59:29.902-06:002014-03-01T17:59:29.902-06:00Is Jesus coming a 3rd time? Whatever happens or do...Is Jesus coming a 3rd time? Whatever happens or doesn’t: do NOT deny the Lord or take a “mark” (nor pull a 2Peter3:4 due to a Prov18:13 mind set). Don’t preach the rapture - preach Christ [Ex20:3] reallayman.webs.com Pre & mid-tribbers believe He’s coming before the trib & also at the end, even though ONLY ONE out of 14 ‘harpazos’ indicate a caught-up for a GROUP. reallayman.webs.com/more/harpazo-inBible.docAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15873211529678508753noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-36354668959537161532014-01-06T02:38:57.619-06:002014-01-06T02:38:57.619-06:00A long time ago...You make a very complete respons...A long time ago...You make a very complete response to a blog post and I never thanked you. I'm not a prophecy expert but just suggest what I think number patterns in scripture might be saying. I need to be more careful to post my ideas as speculation. Thanks so much for your response.Norm Patriquin/AmazingWordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623691057735943184noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-51848897636072596832014-01-06T02:35:40.828-06:002014-01-06T02:35:40.828-06:00It's long overdue, but I wanted to thank you f...It's long overdue, but I wanted to thank you for your comment in my blog.Norm Patriquin/AmazingWordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623691057735943184noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-74932487452796232932013-03-07T20:11:04.690-06:002013-03-07T20:11:04.690-06:00You are correct that God will remove people to a s...You are correct that God will remove people to a safe place before the Day of the Lord. The problem seems to be that pre-trib puts an erroneous definition on that phrase. Nowhere in the Bible is the Day of the Lord equated with tribulation (which is an appellation which does not even exist in the Bible in terms of Daniel's 70th week), nor the Great Tribulation. In fact, if one does a study on that phrase or equivalent phrases (THAT day, Day of indignation, Day of Christ, etc.) one finds that the Scriptures teach that the signs of the Day of the Lord do not come until AFTER the Great Tribulation (Matt. 24:29, Rev. 6:12-17). If the Day of the Lord is precipitated by the rapture, then the rapture cannot occur until sometime after the Great Tribulation. And if the Day of the Lord were to begin at the start of the 70th week, then according to Malachi, Elijah must show up before then, which means he must show up before a pre-trib rapture which means it is not imminent. I also notice you left out verse in 1 Thess. 5:4 which says "But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief." Christians are not going to be surprised by that day. Why not? Because if nothing else, they will see Elijah first, correct? 2 Thess2 . would read as follows if we consider the falling away as a pre-trib rapture. Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, (The 2nd coming) and by our gathering together unto him, (the rapture) That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ (Day of the Lord) is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day (the Day of the Lord/rapture) shall not come, except there come a falling away first (rapture). That is the way pre-trib reads it which is nonsensical. The rapture shall not come, except there come a rapture first? It makes no sense. There are a lot of things that do not make sense in pre-trib. This is just the tip of the iceberg. Conniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16624728134929059941noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-86157568377037366372013-02-20T00:37:05.678-06:002013-02-20T00:37:05.678-06:00I have my own theory on when the rapture will occu...I have my own theory on when the rapture will occur but it is more of a sense of things than a deliberate study. One comment you made I like is if the King James writers had written about the rapture but not noticed it...Since I believe God supernaturally wrote the Bible through its authors, I think they had no idea of the depth of secrets they were sharing from the wisdom of the Holy Spirit.Norm Patriquin/AmazingWordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01623691057735943184noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-89766904532065783532013-01-12T22:18:54.209-06:002013-01-12T22:18:54.209-06:00[Thanks, Norm. You might enjoy this. Saw it on the...[Thanks, Norm. You might enjoy this. Saw it on the web. Bonnie]<br /><br /> Pretrib Rapture Pride<br /><br /> by Bruce Rockwell<br /><br /> Pretrib rapture promoters like Thomas Ice give the impression they know more than the early Church Fathers, the Reformers, the greatest Greek New Testament scholars including those who produced the KJV Bible, the founders of their favorite Bible schools, and even their own mentors!<br /> Ice's mentor, Dallas Sem. president John Walvoord, couldn't find anyone holding to pretrib before 1830 - and Walvoord called John Darby and his Brethren followers "the early pretribulationists" (RQ, pp. 160-62). Ice belittles Walvoord and claims that several pre-1830 persons, including "Pseudo-Ephraem" and a "Rev. Morgan Edwards," taught a pretrib rapture. Even though the first one viewed Antichrist's arrival as the only "imminent" event, Ice (and Grant Jeffrey) audaciously claim he expected an "imminent" pretrib rapture! And Ice (and John Bray) have covered up Edwards' historicism which made a pretrib rapture impossible! Google historian Dave MacPherson's "Deceiving and Being Deceived" for documentation on these and similar historical distortions.<br /> The same pretrib defenders, when combing ancient books, deviously read "pretrib" into phrases like "before Armageddon," "before the final conflagration," and "escape all these things"!<br /> BTW, the KJV translators' other writings found in London's famed British Library (where MacPherson has researched) haven't a hint of pretrib rapturism. Is it possible that Ice etc. have found pretrib "proof" in the KJV that its translators never found?<br /> Pretrib merchandisers like Ice claim that nothing is better pretrib proof than Rev. 3:10. They also cover up "Famous Rapture Watchers" (on Google) which shows how the greatest Greek NT scholars of all time interpreted it.<br /> Pretrib didn't flourish in America much before the 1909 Scofield Bible which has pretribby "explanatory notes" in its margins. Not seen in the margins was jailed forger Scofield's criminal record throughout his life that David Lutzweiler has documented in his recent book "The Praise of Folly" which is available online.<br /> Biola University's doctrinal statement says Christ's return is "premillennial" and "before the Tribulation." Although universities stand for "academic freedom," Biola has added these narrow, restrictive phrases - non-essentials the founders purposely didn't include in their original doctrinal statement when Biola was just a small Bible institute! And other Christian schools have also belittled their founders.<br /> Ice, BTW, has a "Ph.D" issued by a tiny Texas school that wasn't authorized to issue degrees! Ice now says that he's working on another "Ph.D" via the University of Wales in Britain. For light on the degrees of Ice's scholarliness, Google "Bogus degree scandal prompts calls to wind up University of Wales," "Thomas Ice (Bloopers)," "be careful in polemics - Peripatetic Learning," and "Walvoord Melts Ice."<br /> Other fascinating Google articles include "The Unoriginal John Darby," "X-raying Margaret," "Edward Irving in Unnerving," "Pretrib Rapture Politics," "Pretrib Rapture Secrets," "Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty," "Pretrib Hypocrisy," "Pretrib Rapture Secrecy," and "Roots of Warlike Christian Zionism" - most from the author of "The Rapture Plot," the most accurate documentation on pretrib rapture history.<br /> Can anyone guess who the last proud pretrib rapture holdout will be?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-91071738278303144672012-12-04T20:37:23.589-06:002012-12-04T20:37:23.589-06:00and consider learning about Pre-wrath position. and consider learning about Pre-wrath position. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-23486174.post-48980018826765849392012-10-01T08:53:48.645-05:002012-10-01T08:53:48.645-05:00Interesting. You might enjoy Googling "Pretri...Interesting. You might enjoy Googling "Pretrib Rapture Politics," "Pretrib Rapture Secrets" and "Pretrib Rapture Dishonesty." CindyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com